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Emne: Fresh dry tyres in rain |
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#1 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:23:00
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A weird scenario happened to me last race (Mexico). The race started in and I decided to stay out a lot of laps in case of quick weather changes.
So rain stopped lap 17, and rain tyres started melting away rather quick. Starting my lap 24 I could see the tyres were not gonna last 2 more laps, so I had to pit end of lap 24. However, while I was taking corner 3, the leader crossed the line and the rain started again.
A few points about what happened next (I think you can guess it by now)
Point 1: As it started raining again, tyre wear should have slowed down. By looking at wear at the begin of the race I could have done at least 5 more laps on the tyres, but I still pitted because "the tyres couldn't do 1 more lap".
Point 2: So a full minute after the rain had started again I reached the pit. While watching the race live I was yelling at my screen: they better be putting new rain tyres on. You guessed it, they didn't. Why?
Point 3: After the pit stop I had to race 2 full laps on dry tyres in rain before I pitted again for rain tyres. Why did I not pit the next lap? I told them to wait 1 lap when weather changes from dry to wet, but the rain started before my first pit.
I'm not really sure these are bugs, but I didn't know where else to post this.
Also note that my race was already ruined by smoking early and the strategy didn't work out at all because of the high wear of rain tyres in dry. But I still find it a very peculiar series of events that should not have happened.
Any thoughts?
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#2 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:28:30
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aswin that happened to me too but i still got points (and fastest lap)
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#3 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:29:12
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I think, even though the leader started a new lap, according the system, you still had one more full lap to complete before it stopped raining for you, so you pitted before crossing the line when the rain would've started. I think...
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#4 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:32:41 (senest redigeret Jan 16 2021, 10:34:02 af Aswin Witte)
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Quote ( James Hawthorn @ January 16th 2021,10:29:12 ) I think, even though the leader started a new lap, according the system, you still had one more full lap to complete before it stopped raining for you, so you pitted before crossing the line when the rain would've started. I think...
Would that imply that if my pit box was after the finish line, I would have put on rain tyres?
Edit: nevermind, it was after the line... so no
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:23:00 )
A weird scenario happened to me last race (Mexico). The race started in and I decided to stay out a lot of laps in case of quick weather changes.
So rain stopped lap 17, and rain tyres started melting away rather quick. Starting my lap 24 I could see the tyres were not gonna last 2 more laps, so I had to pit end of lap 24. However, while I was taking corner 3, the leader crossed the line and the rain started again.
Any thoughts?
Rain stopped Lap 16 and started Lap 26
After Pit you had started Lap 25 and as you approached Turn 3, Leader had finished his Lap 25 and started Lap 26...
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#6 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:39:25 (senest redigeret Jan 16 2021, 10:56:08 af Kai Wen Chew)
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I had a quick look at your race replay and this is what I gathered...
GPRO unfortunately does not have weather real time, weather is based on the lap itself. So when you saw the weather turn wet, it was because the leader had crossed the line in Lap 26, while you were still on Lap 25 (dry). If your tyres had gone 1 lap more, you would have pitted for wets. But because you went into the pit on Lap 25, your tyres were replaced with Dry tyres instead. Think of it as the weather changing while you were halfway changing your tyres and therefore you were just unlucky in that aspect.
As for your 3rd point, its more to do with understanding what the instruction means. By waiting 1 lap to pit, you are effectively going to drive 2 laps outside - 1 lap as the “wait” instruction and 1 lap as the in lap. Basically you come out on dry tyres, because weather is wet, you would wait 1 lap, and then enter the pit in the subsequent lap after that.
Finally, your pit box position doesn’t change anything. Its just a visual animation on GPRO. GPRO actually just assumes your pit box to be in the middle of that line you cross, every instruction would be based on the lap before.
Hope this answers your question :)
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#7 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:48:52
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:32:41 ) Quote ( James Hawthorn @ January 16th 2021,10:29:12 )
I think, even though the leader started a new lap, according the system, you still had one more full lap to complete before it stopped raining for you, so you pitted before crossing the line when the rain would've started. I think...
Would that imply that if my pit box was after the finish line, I would have put on rain tyres?
Edit: nevermind, it was after the line... so no
Yes, but you entered the pits before the finish line. Though, my understanding of the calculations used to run the race could be wrong.
Your tyres did not have enough life to last one more lap, so you pitted when it was dry, despite the race keader starting the new lap where, for him, it had just started raining again
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#8 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:56:21
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Quote ( Chew Kai Wen @ January 16th 2021,10:39:25 ) GPRO unfortunately does not have weather real time, weather is based on the lap itself. So when you saw the weather turn wet, it was because the leader had crossed the line in Lap 26, while you were still on Lap 25 (dry). If your tyres had gone 1 lap more, you would have pitted for wets. But because you went into the pit on Lap 25, your tyres were replaced with Dry tyres instead. Think of it as the weather changing while you were halfway changing your tyres and therefore you were just unlucky in that aspect.
Ok, so every racer has it's personal cloud that started raining at the start of lap 26?
Then I find this line from the rules a bit misleading: "If it is raining, we assume the whole circuit is wet."
One more question to finish it off. If I would have been lapped before the rain started again, would this still apply? Or does that change it again?
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#9 Skrevet Jan 16 2021, 10:58:43 (senest redigeret Jan 16 2021, 11:02:10 af Kai Wen Chew)
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:56:21 ) Ok, so every racer has it's personal cloud that started raining at the start of lap 26?
Yes
Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:56:21 ) Then I find this line from the rules a bit misleading: "If it is raining, we assume the whole circuit is wet."
I think that this statement doesn't talk so much about different laps, its just assuming the circuit is 100% wet on that lap. In real life F1 tracks, when it starts raining the circuit doesn't become wet immediately, it takes time.
On GPRO, when it starts raining, the track becomes 100% wet. So any time lost would be as if there is a 100% wet track in play, and not a gradual build up to a 100% wet track.
Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:56:21 ) If I would have been lapped before the rain started again, would this still apply? Or does that change it again?
Yes, it still applies. You would still be in the wrong lap and hence would be still on dry conditions.
It gets a bit confusing when viewing the new race screen, but basically GPRO when simulating the races actually lines all the cars in 1 straight line. So when it is Lap 25, everyone is in a straight line from the front to the back of the grid. The lapping and overtakes are really just visual inputs into the game system.
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:56:21 ) Then I find this line from the rules a bit misleading: "If it is raining, we assume the whole circuit is wet." Do you know a better solution?
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Quote ( Chew Kai Wen @ January 16th 2021,10:58:43 )
On GPRO, when it starts raining, the track becomes 100% wet. So any time lost would be as if there is a 100% wet track in play, and not a gradual build up to a 100% wet track. Remember! In reality, many times part of the track is dry and some is wet. This cannot happen here.
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:23:00 ) A weird scenario happened to me last race (Mexico).
As ever, it’s easier to determine what’s going on if you look at the older race viewer.
You pitted for dry tyres on lap 25, and the rain restarted on lap 26. You then pitted again for rain tyres on lap 27.
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Besides the personal cloud and bubble of weather ...
The simple solution to handle quick change of weather (during a typical rain race) is to set the 'dry track tyre type' at wets...
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Quote ( Tibor Szuromi @ January 16th 2021,11:00:06 ) Do you know a better solution?
Something to the extend what Chew Kai Wen wrote above, that weather is not global but update personally.
Quote ( Tibor Szuromi @ January 16th 2021,11:04:23 ) Remember! In reality, many times part of the track is dry and some is wet. This cannot happen here.
This part is actually well described in the noob guide, so that was clear.
Looking at the amount of threads discussing weather mechanics, I think there could be a better description in the rules. As I'm not clear on the mechanics myself, I'm not comfortable providing such a description myself. Now it seems like it's up to everyone to read endless pages of discussions in forum and hope to find some true statements.
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,10:56:21 ) Then I find this line from the rules a bit misleading: "If it is raining, we assume the whole circuit is wet."
Now you may start to get some people angry. I think these "misleading things" are called "features".
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Same situation was faced by the race winner in our group glen fury yesterday.
His situation was Better than yours.
He was leading the race and for the last lap without rain his wet tyres couldn't last any longer and then he entered the pit lane on the live race scren his pit box ahead of the finish line (i know the live screen is not true actually) . He came out with dry tyres with start of rain .
Then on end of a lap with dry tyres he pitted again to get the wet tyres very unlucky there but he still won the race.
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The race is simulated as one 300km long straight line. I suppose imagining this instead of cars going around in circles can resolve a lot of confusions. I guess this could be written somewhere in FAQ or wiki to save a lot of doubts.
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Quote ( Aswin Witte @ January 16th 2021,11:54:48 ) This part is actually well described in the noob guide, so that was clear.
Looking at the amount of threads discussing weather mechanics, I think there could be a better description in the rules. As I'm not clear on the mechanics myself, I'm not comfortable providing such a description myself. Now it seems like it's up to everyone to read endless pages of discussions in forum and hope to find some true statements.
The rule had no problems with the old race viewer. Since the new viewer was introduceed, it sometimes makes things seem a bit different from what's actually happening in the claculations. As most of the active playerbase has probably experienced the old race viewer, it wasn't a problem. As newer players first experience the new race viewer, weather changes can become a bit confusing.
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