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Foorumi teema küsitlus
Are you OK with how GPRO acts in terms of war situation?
Logi sisse et hääletada või vaadata küsitluse tulemusi
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Teema: Are you OK with how GPRO acts in terms of war situation? |
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This week I contacted GPRO admins to know if they are OK having a forum topic full of kremlin propaganda, are they OK to have Sochi GP, and aren't they going to express support for Ukraine, for example renaming Sochi GP to Ukrainian GP.
I got the answer (from Vlad, haven't heard from Stefan yet) that GPRO is going to stay neutral, and that forum topic is an exception for both sides to have opportunity to to discuss.
Under these circumstances I find such attitude highly immoral. And giving platform for kremlin propaganda that tires to justify those murderers and rapists for me is totally unacceptable.
So being a member of this community for 12 years I ask you if you are ok with that.
Because I am not OK, and as much as I love this game, I am not going to continue until/if GRPO condemns the war and removes all attributes of criminal state from it.
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Freedom of speech and expression is important, this is a highly emotive subject and in all honesty the admins cannot win whatever they do. Most sensible people know that very little that comes out of Russia on the subject is true, even the description of it not being a war. The GP isn't taking place in Russia, its on a computer server, it's simply a name, what is gained from removing it?
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The reason why that forum post exists and hasn't been taken off is so it doesn't spread out of control and have a million and one topics about it, it can be all put in one topic. You can simply ignore the topic by pressing the red stop button on the bottom right. If the topic got closed, there would be a lot more forum topics about it and the mods would have a hard time to close it all. I don't blame them for wanting to stay neutral, they simply don't want to get involved with it all
As for the Sochi GP, at the end of the day, it's a virtual track, with no association to the country. If you feel its wrong to race there, simply don't race. At the end of the day it's a virtual thing, it's got nothing to do with Russia, its not promoting Russia, we don't go to Russia
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I am 100% against Putins invasion. But GPRO is not a political organization and it is not funneling money or supplies to Russia. I am fine with people being able to post Russian propaganda as long as everyone else is able to shout it down and point out its ludicrous-ness. This is one of the few places in the world where Russians, whether they support Putin or not, and non-Russians can still interact. Even if the war thread is generally a disaster the fact of its existence is still a good thing. I personally am looking forward to driving my car with Ukrainian colors through the streets of Sochi.
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Mark and Kyle have explained everything already.
This is mainly about freedom of speech. Yes, some people are spreading what could be seen as propaganda, but we are not the ones to judge what is right and what is wrong. That does not mean that the staff agrees with those views, and i find those accusations extremely disrespectful.
First of all, we allowed the topic because its simply important. This is not to say that other events of this kind arent as "bad", "important" or anything else of that nature, but its simply an event that will (and already has) affect the whole world. Secondly, as Kyle already said, we allowed it so it is condensend into one topic. Otherwise it would inevitably spread throughout the whole forum and we would have to remove anything related to it. I doubt most players would find that a better alternative and would instead throw around accusations of bias, as we would have to remove ukrainian posts too.
We have discussed this in great detail and decided our course of action as a team. We had the wellbeing of the whole community in mind, and didnt just do whatever we felt like.
As for the Sochi GP:
Im sorry, but why is this even a discussion?
Its literally just a virtual track. There arent any politics involved that allow us to "race" there. We dont get paid for it. We dont have any affiliations to any russian organisations, track owners or anything else related to Sochi irl. And dont forget that it would massively screw with everyones season plans if we were to remove it. Not to mention the technical difficulties of replacing a track midseason.
You can always choose to not "race" there, and just not qualify.
If we removed every track whose country has engaged in acts of wars, supplied wars, or is involved in any inhumane/shady businesses, we wouldnt have any tracks left.
This is a game, not the real world. After all, we come here to have fun, right?
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You are talking about GPRO being neutral.....
IRL, A Lot of countries have neutral stance on this situation....
Its absolutely fine staying neutral because we have both Ukrainian and Russian Communities here and we have a dedicated topic related to the current ongoing situation.
As Sean mentioned, its a virtual online race
Regarding Sochi race......... If some people want to BOYCOTT..... you can boycott.... and the ones who want to race will race.......
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Russia doesn’t profit from GPRO staging an online race with a track named after one of its cities. Why should it be cancelled? There’s no real world financial reason for that to happen. Unless you’re offended by the name of a track and a flag? I guess if people are, they should not race and let everyone else do what they want, rather than expect game admins to take a political stand against something that I rightly think they are best served to not get involved with since making a stand will serve only to cause division within the community.
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I have mix feelings regarding the decision of GPRO neutrality.
I guess if you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. Whatever are the war reasons, nothing justify innocent people being killed and somehow I feel the war topic is not respecting at all those innocents.
I think it was my first time ignoring a topic... still don't feel great on ignoring it. :/
Like most of you are saying, this is a game. Therefore, the game should not be used as a platform for political discussions and propaganda.
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Quote ( Paulo Pinto @ April 3rd 2022,16:46:29 ) I have mix feelings regarding the decision of GPRO neutrality.
I guess if you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. Whatever are the war reasons, nothing justify innocent people being killed and somehow I feel the war topic is not respecting at all those innocents.
I think it was my first time ignoring a topic... still don't feel great on ignoring it. :/
Like most of you are saying, this is a game. Therefore, the game should not be used as a platform for political discussions and propaganda.
There is also nothing stopping them, or anyone, publicly condemning all acts of war so as to avoid what you mention about how a neutral stance can be viewed as supporting the oppressor. I am unsure if assuming that is a fair assumption, but if people stay silent on such matters then I can understand why some might feel that way.
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Civilized world? Seriously?
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Once a position is taken/shown/indicated you immediately have opposition. That type of discussion is never ending and seldom of any use because people will get 'personal' in their responses and attack instead of "discuss" in the virtual world. Inevitably someone will say 'you don't know what you are talking about' and that will be taken as an insult. Blah blah blah...
How many combatants would say "I came be here to be killed... and to kill."
I don't care if you are Ukrainian or Russian, you can agree that seeing your fellow countrymen being killed is not good, EVER!
That is the only side to this story that makes sense. The rest is egos and BS justification for engaging in war and political posturing.
Even this thread is an invitation to argue. Have 'fun' :(
Just my opinion... these threads should be closed it's over a month and 3300 responses since it started. I'm sure we come to have some agreement as to who is 'wrong'
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If you REALLY want to help, donate money like me, for Ukrainian refugees. Stop trying to be nice with vague gestures. Everyone has many issues in his life and this game is the way how to refresh the batteries. You are free to avoid playing. Yourself. It is your will. If you believe it helps to somebody, just do it. But stop dictating others what they should do. Do not play Putin. Thanks..
This is the game, not a political platform.
The standpoint of GPRO crew is shown clearly by fact, that this thread has not been deleted, because normally it is against the rules.
Just donate..
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People: "Racing and politics shouldn't be mixed, we just enjoy the sport and our passion for the race"
Also people: "What if we boycott a virtual race?"
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I am absolutely sure that nobody here agrees with this war. But bringing the conflict to this stage would not help solve anything, rather, it would fuel absurd fights between players who have little or no control over this war.
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Quote ( Liudvikas Selmistraitis @ April 3rd 2022,15:58:43 ) ... I am not going to continue until/if GRPO condemns the war and removes all attributes of criminal state from it.
I hope someone misses you, good luck!
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Is it true that more than half of the countries in the world are not civilized?
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What is this...
There are always 2 sides to a medal so styaying neutral is the most intellegent way of going
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Quote ( George Slater @ April 3rd 2022,17:22:15 ) Civilized world? Seriously?
I look around me and I see houses instead of caves.
I have a car or public transportation, I have internet, cinemas, museums, TV, I am dressed, I have heat and cooling, I can store my food, my children go to school and they learn foreign languages, I am not afraid to express my opinion, I am not afraid to be killed, I am not afraid to let my children go out and play without having to look at them all the time. I can travel around the world and meet other people and see places.
I can keep writting till I use all the allowed characters within a post and then post more in a different post again and again
I feel I live in a civilzed world, yes
Now, if we chose as our leaders monkeys that make this world look like shit, it's our own fault. As long as we support them, we get what we deserve.
Of course, there are places where civilazation hasn't been a reality yet. But this is our world.
You can't say we live in a jungle because there are jungles, You don't say we live in deserts because there are deserts. Jungles and deserts are part of this planet, as are our cities, towns, villages.
I feel sorry to see people thinking we are not civilized. I hope you wake up soon and change your lives. We (you) have the power to do it. Giving up and moaning isn't the right way to deal with it.
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The sanctions around the world are in order to make Russia stop its military actions. Is renaming a virtual track in a game does something actually? No. Then there is no reason to do it.
Kyle, Mark and Sean explained it.
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I don't care anymore, I sent the mud pit to the ignore list.
And I don't want to give ideas, to the ones who didn't ignore it, about how to "sanction" GPRO. ;-)
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lets start a petition to change the location of Sochi GP from Russian Federation to 78.142.57.18
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I don't think it's good to be "neutral" in front of an aggression. We have a word in Italy for this behavior which is "paraculo". At the same time I don't think they should cancel Sochi GP. It's just a label.
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As mass graves and executed civilian bodies, shot in the back of the head, some with their hands tied behind their backs, are found strewn on the streets of Bucha, I find this ”neutrality” stance very very problematic.
Racing at Sochi feels absurd in these circumstances.
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Great, We have second forum for war.
How much more 99% of managers need to suffer by these forums?
Can you please move these topics out of GPRO?
People come here to race and to have nice time, not to read this.
Who want to chat about war, there is hundreds of forum topics so go there and enjoy.
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Totally opposite , we are here to race a F1 game , not to speak about war. There are also wars in Yemen and Syria and other countries in Africa but we are not speaking about it. Is it enough one war/political forum about Ukraine? Why we need to see this again and again. That topic should be banned in this game, let's race.
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Just race in the Ukraine Livery at Sochi, if you think it is important to give Putin the finger on his "Virtual Soil" in Gpro.
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If the race in Sochi is ignored, it will be canceled! In general, the race in Sochi should be canceled!
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Quote ( Serhiy Cherkasov @ April 4th 2022,12:52:16 ) If the race in Sochi is ignored, it will be canceled! In general, the race in Sochi should be canceled!
Why? What is wrong with some track in some virtual game? You have enough time to spend here discussing on GPRO. Why are you not fighting in your army.
I was in the war when NATO tried to destroy my country Serbia 1999. Didn't have time to spend on some virtual manager games.
If you don't like Sochi track don't race.
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Quote ( Liudvikas Selmistraitis @ April 3rd 2022,15:58:43 ) OK to have Sochi GP,
I didn't read all the stuff but I knew that one day it would come out and I would have to speak up. I wonder how a good player arrives at this question, knowing that other good players have prepared for months to play not exclusively, but exactly this GP [in terms of, for example, a favorite track, in terms of strategic car planning, tests], and that its withdrawal During the Current Season could mean and bring distortions in terms of promotion and relegation, which would be the biggest betrayal that the game could commit against its community.
The attempt to transport certain issues from the so-called 'real world' reaches the height of the misunderstanding of the game exactly here.
[Gpro is an invented place. I wouldn't disagree if we invented a Mariupol track there, with the same characteristics and specs, and called it the Mariupol GP, in honor Not of the Azov, but of the poor people and the workers of the town, children of those who were proudly soviet workers 40, 50, 60 years ago; two coastal cities btw]
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I understand the sentiment, but i don't understand why people don't see that not racing on a virtual track is not really making a statement of any kind.
Can i propose a very simple solution to this problem inspired by the acts of some Baltic countries?
Rename the Sochi GP the "Zelenskyy Awesomeskyy GP", slap a NATO flag on it, and poof: everybody happy. Ish.
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