Quote ( Mariano Marchesan @ June 20th 2011,18:20:26 )
Some people should try to learn how to beat the system and succed at doing it rather than find excuses for the failure, If you had relegate is not because someone was better than you in one race, is because you were constantly slower than other 25 managers during the season.
This is hillarious, the exact point is that the system doesn't punish those who are constantly slower than the average. It rewards them on their single non-bad result.
Some of us actually try to come up with constructive ways to make the game better rather than beating or exploiting the system. Well, to each his/her own. Leo summed up the results beautifully of trying to be creative rather than destructive in their opinions about the game.
From running the numbers on a few groups through various point systems. Of those I tested, my vote would be on top-15 (25,20,17,14,12,10-1)
I think it is not really fair to have 40 starters and award points only to the first 8 Positions, but for archive reasons I like the proposal of Laila, as this is IMO the fairest option without making past results totally untrue, and there are / would be still managers who don't are in all the races in the top 24 so there is no point in running a car from race 4-6 (when it first brakes down) to race - lets say 14-15 in dropping out mode (pretty sure no finishes in Top 24) and then update/upgrade it for the last 2-3 races again and hunt for a top 8 Position, as till then you should be around 20 Points behind the last holding position as it is nearly impossible that there are always the same 8 in the Points and the same 16 on Positions 9-24...
of course in that case there should be better points for 1-8, which has to be figured out, as I do also agree that twice finishing 24th should not let a one time (and always then below 24th finisher, which is IMO not really likely, but that just on a side note)... But this keeps the upper mentioned tactic from being used too heavily, especially in the lower leagues where I saw it a lot of times lately and this would make the game a bit fairer to those who don't want to use this one big push tactic but try to race every race in the midfield... and THIS is IMO what this game should support...
Quote ( Leonardo Bittencourt @ June 20th 2011,19:22:18 )
That is why these kinds of discussions never go anywhere.
1: People that want change: "Ok here are the reasons" *procedes to makes essay lenght posts with points and more points on why, how etc* 2: People that don't want change: "Oh, sorry those are not reasons" *proced to deny everything that is written based on personal bias*. 3: People that want change: *bangs head against wall, some return to step 1, some don't bother*.
I honestly don't care what system they implement, as long as they announce it at least 2 seasons in advance. I am pretty sure I will do equally well no matter what the system is.
Marcelo, back to average system, the how about winner manager 40P manager result 40th 1 point. then at the end of the season you divide the total points by 17 and you average everyone, 25 first managers stay, rest relegate, no starters get a point.
Quote ( Pål Göran Stensson @ June 20th 2011,20:40:37 )
This is hillarious, the exact point is that the system doesn't punish those who are constantly slower than the average. It rewards them on their single non-bad result.
One win and 16 36th positions still better then 17 9th I just think it is a better hand, it is like cards. If you want to change the point system I think you are "attacking" the issue the wrong way. Motor racing is not about to punish nor reward, is not even about consistency. You got one winner and second is the first looser. The only part that I agree is the fact that this scoring system was not meant for 40 car grid. And secondly points means money, if you want more points how about the money?.
Quote ( Mariano Marchesan @ June 20th 2011,22:45:41 )
One win and 16 36th positions still better then 17 9th
how do you work that out? Do you think if that happened in professional motor racing, that person would retain their seat for the next year? No. they would probably be released from their contract, much like being relegated.
Quote ( Finn Shaw-McIver @ June 20th 2011,22:48:22 )
Do you think if that happened in professional motor racing, that person would retain their seat for the next year? No. they would probably be released from their contract, much like being relegated.
You can change your driver if you like at any time in GPRO, just pay the penalty for hiring a new driver with remaining contract for the old one.
Quote ( Finn Shaw-McIver @ June 20th 2011,22:53:29 )
It is not about the driver on this game, it's about the managers.
The same as you I used selective reading, you compare results to driver being terminated. And yet I remind you you are not the driver you are the manager. I don't see any reason that some one who whatever method used has won a race should relegate to a manager who have never won anything. Points are not to be earned, should be won.
Quote ( Mariano Marchesan @ June 20th 2011,22:45:41 )
The only part that I agree is the fact that this scoring system was not meant for 40 car grid.
If you agree to this, then why not change the point system and extend it. The only thing that is wrong with the point system in regards to the field is that the number of scoring drivers are too few..
Quote ( Mariano Marchesan @ June 20th 2011,22:45:41 )
And secondly points means money, if you want more points how about the money?.
I answered that in my first post as I saw the question coming. Its not really hard to change it to scale with another point system to amount to the same cash, give or take a few cents.
I'm not even arguing this from my own benefit. If you look at my history and my _one_ promotion so far. I was never in the need of pushing at all. I did pick up a bunch of 9:th's though. Unless I promote by mistake tonight, I'm sure that when I hit pro in season 27 as planned, I won't be nowhere near needing a OBP to retain.
I can see teammates and for that matter, one guy from my own group who will relegate today that did a lot better season than a couple of the guys retaining. One guy is retaining with 7 races missed, 9/10 below top-15 and one fourth spot from Montreal which was a rain race and he probably struck jackpot with his strategy.
Quote ( Pål Göran Stensson @ June 20th 2011,23:13:19 )
If you agree to this, then why not change the point system and extend it.
Because was sated clear in the rules when I joined the game, and I accepted that way. Again I go to my prior example when I got to pro, there was 25 managers who where better than me disregarding their game tactics or race strategies; They did a better job than me; So what do I do?, I learn from my mistakes and try again. Heidi Aareskoski she does not seem to have any problems with the point system, she is faster than the rest. Seeing things like that made me ask myself if I know enough of the game and where is that I am failing; Not that the scoring system is flawed.
Quote ( Pål Göran Stensson @ June 20th 2011,23:13:19 )
One guy is retaining with 7 races missed, 9/10 below top-15 and one fourth spot from Montreal which was a rain race and he probably struck jackpot with his strategy.
He probably did, yet hes got one fourth position. Why your average slow teammate deserves to stay and Johnny Jackpot deserves to relegate? That is the part that I don't see.
I'd like same scoring points as in MotoGp: 1st to 15th 25,20,16,13,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1. I believe it would be correct something like that when in the starting grid there always 35-40 people...
Well in F1 u dont have 40 cars racing at the same time... and they give pts to the first what 10guys?
so at least in gpro u should give pts to the first 10-12guys... it would be fair... i think it isnt far for someone to always finish around place 9-12... and not get a few pts... and someone that is always finishing around place 20-40 and then achieve a 4th or 5th place and get in front of a constant player that is always finishing races around 10th-12th
the 25-18-15-12-10-8-6-4-2-1 i think wont be good cuz if someone won 4-5 races would be hard to catch even if u won 8-10second places!
I think that a podium at the q should also be rewarded: 1st-3points 2nd-2points 3rd-1point
No thats not good point. so even the retainers can get points in no way. They will just qualify on Ex's for every race (dry) with low fuel load in Q2 and get pole and then will just smoke whole race.
I think that a podium at the q should also be rewarded: 1st-3points 2nd-2points 3rd-1point No thats not good point. so even the retainers can get points in no way. They will just qualify on Ex's for every race (dry) with low fuel load in Q2 and get pole and then will just smoke whole race.
it would be an option... but even if ppl did that... achieving always a podium at qualifying would require to master dry/wet and wet/dry , master temperature changes, and forget about race!
if you would open more spots for ppl to get pts at the finish line... if someone got a first place and earned 20 or 25pts... u would need 7-9pole positions to get the same points...!
so think with me... if a few ppl go just for poles... there would be some competition between them... and it would be hard for 1 to win all pole positions... or even enough to get a top4 at the end of a season! I believe that with the current pt system the pole position points arent viable but with a new system of points y!
PS. i think that poles should also be considered for bonus that we would have to pay to our drivers! :P
From my experience especially in amateur someone can have 1 decent race score 4-5 points and think right thats it im safe in this division now i can take it easier and run lower risks.
if you had a bigger spread of points say for positions 1-10 it stop people scoring a few points then taking it easy, if theres a chance of relegation or not gaining promotion people would race more, and surely thats what we want .........racing
could even make out the point system we use the old Formula 1 point scoring system WHERE managers in positions 1-8 get 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 points respectively.
I think the current sytem leads to people getting a few points then realizing they are safe and then taking it easy running low risks, blocking training their drivers and not racing
We have far too many managers racing in every race to only have 8 places awarding points. Excluding Rookie Groups, in every race there are more than 30 managers racing, so even 15 places with points would seem fair. Creators have always said it's not real F1 and all, but then we can add rockets to the cars, add a bunch other crap as well, since it's not real F1. Come on, people! It's F1-like racing. FIA we re not stupid to add places with points just because more teams were added in real life. Going from 20 to 24 racers, forced them to give points to 8 instead of 6 racers. So, having 30+ racers here, it is insane to award points to only 8 racers!
Quote ( Matteo Bacchini @ June 28th 2011,17:47:56 )
I'd like same scoring points as in MotoGp: 1st to 15th 25,20,16,13,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1. I believe it would be correct something like that when in the starting grid there always 35-40 people...
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