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should users of spiders be punished?
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Topik: spiders |
198 balasan
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Quote ( Feri Ács @ January 17th 2012,10:50:13 )
What can you do with CSV, that doesn't with XLS?
this...
I'm genuinely curious.
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cat Drivers.csv | perl -e 'while(<>) { do_stuff() }'
would be one example of why a csv would be nicer than xls (Which isn't really an xls either..). However, you might as well work with the xml file in that case, a little less coding overhead on a csv directly though.
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Ah...linux is one thing I have never really properly got to grips with, but I shall take your word for it...certainly though you wouldn't want to pipe an xls sheet for use with a basic command, this I can see clearly :-D
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just strip html tags and you have your csv
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What I might do if I decide to do something on the data is to set up a simple mysql db, shove all the data in there and then build whatever queries I'd like on it. The raw data -> db data would be very quick with a csv file. I haven't look at the xls download, just the xml and that will do just fine.
Basically, to anyone that want to do stuff with the data outside of proprietary programs likes to have it in some open, more or less simple format. csv, xml or whatever. Preferably not stuff like doc, xls, .appleownsyou etc..
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Quote ( Pål Göran Stensson @ January 18th 2012,17:05:51 )
Basically, to anyone that want to do stuff with the data outside of proprietary programs likes to have it in some open, more or less simple format. csv, xml or whatever. Preferably not stuff like doc, xls, .appleownsyou etc.. The point is that the xls file it's not a real proprietary xls, just a renamed html file, so to make it "become" a csv you basicly just need to strip html tags and replace with a column separator.
Quote ( Pål Göran Stensson @ January 18th 2012,17:05:51 )
What I might do if I decide to do something on the data is to set up a simple mysql db, shove all the data in there and then build whatever queries I'd like on it. That's exactly what I do right now, just not with the drivers db but other data available.
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Quote ( Marco Predappio @ January 18th 2012,17:09:26 )
The point is that the xls file it's not a real proprietary xls, just a renamed html file, so to make it "become" a csv you basicly just need to strip html tags and replace with a column separator.
Well yes, there are always ways to massage data into something you can use. Just a question of how much work it is. You could import it into excel and then save it as a csv again. However, for large datasets this can become boring work and prone to errors. I often work on tens or hundreds of gigs of log data, assurance that there are no errors introduced by the massaging is then a real problem as you cannot reasonably validate it.
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Quote ( Pål Göran Stensson @ January 18th 2012,17:12:49 )
Just a question of how much work it is. It's less work compared to what a spider did before for sure. Anyway in this specific case it doesn't need to pass through excel.
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ALFA CIPERMETRIN would do ok with spiders
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Do arranging data in Shortlist was a supporter feature?
Cos, I'm not available to do it now. It is working with free drivers & TD, but not for bought drivers. *And I haven't used any of 'spiders' after Race3, if GO is 'Spider' then sorry*
So - was that a supp feature?
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Quote ( Raimonds Urtāns @ January 21st 2012,15:58:14 )
Do arranging data in Shortlist was a supporter feature?
Cos, I'm not available to do it now. It is working with free drivers & TD, but not for bought drivers. *And I haven't used any of 'spiders' after Race3, if GO is 'Spider' then sorry*
So - was that a supp feature?
this feature was removed sometime towards the end of last season possibly race 15
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Or Spider?
For example, the GO ...
What is GO beneficial owner, the owner? Who or what the money has access to these data?
Each time, many players give their input codes and passwords! To Mr. X (GO)
Information is read. Each receives its data and is satisfied. For free ...
But as a whole. Spider organizer takes all user data. For all ... Game in which the information is the key ...
Industrial Espionage!
Fair game? NO
FOBY:)
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Quote ( Ilmars Licitis @ January 21st 2012,23:17:37 )
Or Spider?
For example, the GO ...
What is GO beneficial owner, the owner? Who or what the money has access to these data?
Each time, many players give their input codes and passwords! To Mr. X (GO)
Information is read. Each receives its data and is satisfied. For free ...
But as a whole. Spider organizer takes all user data. For all ... Game in which the information is the key ...
Industrial Espionage!
Fair game? NO
FOBY:)
That reminds me a David Guetta's song: Delirious.
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Quote ( Ilmars Licitis @ January 21st 2012,23:17:37 )
FOBY:) I'm ArachnoFOFY!
:)
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Quote ( Marcelo Ascencio @ January 22nd 2012,03:18:14 )
I'm ArachnoFOFY! Very good :)
I'm a FOBYphiliac :)
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All users using GO should be entering their read only password and not their access password.
Problem is that read only does not display historical data, not even for the previous race, which means team software that makes use of historical race info still need the full access password. :( (This is important as it shows race wear figures, actual driver data which is not available form race analysis).
With the creation of true third party access methods into the GPRO world, could the developers please consider giving the read only password access to the historical race report for the previous race only.
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Quote ( Ilmars Licitis @ January 21st 2012,23:17:37 )
Industrial Espionage!
Fair game? NO
FOBY:)
FOBY as to how Wireshark works and thus FOBY as to wether such "espionage" occurs with GO.
Might also want to FOBY if you think it's acceptable to libel a tool and the person / people behind it.
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Quote ( William Cairns @ January 22nd 2012,14:14:36 )
With the creation of true third party access methods into the GPRO world, could the developers please consider giving the read only password access to the historical race report for the previous race only.
Its the risk that you take by giving the Danish bloke your password, you'll gain from it but he could easily nick everything and cyber rape your identity, its a matter of weighing up the risks.
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Quote ( Jed Lilly @ January 22nd 2012,14:29:04 )
Its the risk that you take by giving the Danish bloke your password, you'll gain from it but he could easily nick everything and cyber rape your identity, its a matter of weighing up the risks.
My GO was last updated in season 17.
We have out own tools - but we lose info when people go on holiday - getting the extra info that race history adds would be great :)
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Quote ( Vladimir Alexandrov @ May 27th 2016,17:26:56 ) So before this discussion goes quiet, what is the general opinion on a total ban of all spiders/tools/robots etc? Basically anything that logs in to the site pretending to be a player. I was always interested to hear the opinions on this :)
Just read the interview page and missed all those posts when they happened.
I personally don't think there's anything wrong with spiders as without them the game would struggle to keep new players even more than it does now.
To prevent misuse of them though I'd suggest to limit the number of requests a spider can do. For that though there would need to be a system in place that could detect if a spider or the player is online.
Tbh with the new addition on the sponsor page I see no reason for Danny to visit anyone's profiles now as the info that was only accessible there is now available on the sponsor manager page and all other data is available along with 39 others on staff and car level pages. This in turn should reduce Danny requesting 39 pages less than before per group..
I use spiders myself not to the extent of others mainly to log setup and the progress of sponsors in my group. Both combined request no more than 10 pages.
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My opinion on tools is a tool shouldn't be able to input figures in the game.
A player should all have to input their own figures and not be automatically entered from an external tool.
I am more than happy for a tool to take whatever data they want, store the data, capture it, parse it whatever etc.
However there shouldn't be a method where a manager can click a button and that tool will log in to the site go to the set pages and upgrade/downgrade parts, run testing, run p.laps etc. I believe all of this should be manual. Anything leaving the site should be allowed to be captured by a tool but anything needing input should be manually input by a player.
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I just finished programming my own "Spider"...
We built a Team tool, each Manager has to start his Excel(Plugin) himself on his machine, the tool collects the data and puts it to our Team dropbox. Common Data is only collected once. In case of a Holiday Absence we use a personal virtual machine which can run the tool automatically (only if account is in Holiday mode)...
Would be great if there were a simple data-api, like this the load on the Servers generated by Tools/bots/Spiders would be lower...
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Completely agree with Michael Keeney's comment.
A tool should be about data collection and comparison, what conclusions managers derive from said data, or which actions managers take based on said data: that should be decided and done by themselves.
I just started playing a few weeks ago, and the manual gathering of data is already getting cumbersome. If a small script running locally helps with that (by grabbing data once or twice for each race), awesome! If (like Rolf said) we can aggregate said data as a team, even better.
Data APIs would make things easier on the development side, not so convinced it will lower server loads in any way.
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Auto filling fields is a moot point imho.
I guess it stops typos (if coded correctly) but we should be aspiring for typos not to be a main management skill deferentiator anyway
As for 'auto-decision' making tools passing across form values then that's just a manager blindly trusting the tool and I think it's really subjective if that's actually an advantage or not. It can probably hinder as often as help.
One thing for sure is 'playing' GPRO with such a tool would just take the fun out of it & personally I don't see the point. But auto filling the web pages I don't see as a massive issue. Just cos someone has a tool to do it doesn't mean it's gonna be right :)
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Gosh! everything I'm reading makes me want to quit. How can I compete against all this tech? Will I have to hire a programmer to keep up?
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Quote ( Marcelo Ascencio @ June 2nd 2016,13:27:47 ) Gosh! everything I'm reading makes me want to quit. How can I compete against all this tech? Will I have to hire a programmer to keep up? I think you'd find it a lot easier if there were a lot of managers who trust tools for decision-making
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What's the difference between a tool that gives you your set up, for example, and one that gives you your set up and inputs it for you. It's surely just convenience and can't see it making any impact on the server, which is what the initial discussion regarding spiders was about?
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